Comments on: The Stupidity of Writers… http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2009/04/03/the-stupidity-of-writers/ Jeff VanderMeer Fri, 19 Mar 2010 23:38:31 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Seth Merlo http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2009/04/03/the-stupidity-of-writers/comment-page-1/#comment-21690 Seth Merlo Sun, 05 Apr 2009 15:52:27 +0000 http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=1088#comment-21690 The political question is a toughie, alright. I agree with both perspectives - I agree with you, Jeff, that some truths transcend politics, art for art's sake etc. But I agree with Bakker in the sense that simply stating that some truths transcend doesn't simplify anything. That the phrase 'art for art's sake' is problematic since any concept of beauty or artistry that we might bring to the piece in question is entirely 'conditioned by context' (a brilliant portion of his essay, by the way). Completely agree with your thought that "if we don't, at some point during our writing, think about this consciously — if we simply trust our instincts as writers — we may unintentionally preserve cliché, stereotype, and prejudice." Which, of course, is relevant to everyone, not just writers. The political question is a toughie, alright. I agree with both perspectives – I agree with you, Jeff, that some truths transcend politics, art for art’s sake etc. But I agree with Bakker in the sense that simply stating that some truths transcend doesn’t simplify anything. That the phrase ‘art for art’s sake’ is problematic since any concept of beauty or artistry that we might bring to the piece in question is entirely ‘conditioned by context’ (a brilliant portion of his essay, by the way).

Completely agree with your thought that “if we don’t, at some point during our writing, think about this consciously — if we simply trust our instincts as writers — we may unintentionally preserve cliché, stereotype, and prejudice.” Which, of course, is relevant to everyone, not just writers.

]]> By: Nick Mamatas http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2009/04/03/the-stupidity-of-writers/comment-page-1/#comment-21674 Nick Mamatas Sat, 04 Apr 2009 17:50:20 +0000 http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=1088#comment-21674 <i> 4 eggs and a piece toast. a bowl of porridge, a cockroach, and a knuckle sandwich</i> See?!?!?!

4 eggs and a piece toast.

a bowl of porridge, a cockroach, and a knuckle sandwich

See?!?!?!

]]> By: Steve Tem http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2009/04/03/the-stupidity-of-writers/comment-page-1/#comment-21666 Steve Tem Sat, 04 Apr 2009 08:44:27 +0000 http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=1088#comment-21666 Embrace the contradictions, I say. I find that when I'm targeting current politics more or less directly (which isn't often), my fiction takes on its most absurd flavors. I do believe serious writing is a kind of testimony as to how the author felt about his or her time on the planet--that certainly includes politics, but it includes a lot of other things as well. When I'm writing art for art's sake I easily veer in and out of the sentimental, because I find that what I'm really writing about is what I believe to be beautiful, what I would like to see preserved. And any time you're talking about preservation I think you've taken at least a small step into politics. Embrace the contradictions, I say. I find that when I’m targeting current politics more or less directly (which isn’t often), my fiction takes on its most absurd flavors. I do believe serious writing is a kind of testimony as to how the author felt about his or her time on the planet–that certainly includes politics, but it includes a lot of other things as well. When I’m writing art for art’s sake I easily veer in and out of the sentimental, because I find that what I’m really writing about is what I believe to be beautiful, what I would like to see preserved. And any time you’re talking about preservation I think you’ve taken at least a small step into politics.

]]> By: Jeff VanderMeer http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2009/04/03/the-stupidity-of-writers/comment-page-1/#comment-21659 Jeff VanderMeer Sat, 04 Apr 2009 04:04:02 +0000 http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=1088#comment-21659 4 eggs and a piece toast. a bowl of porridge, a cockroach, and a knuckle sandwich 4 eggs and a piece toast.

a bowl of porridge, a cockroach, and a knuckle sandwich

]]> By: Marty Stephenson http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2009/04/03/the-stupidity-of-writers/comment-page-1/#comment-21657 Marty Stephenson Sat, 04 Apr 2009 03:56:09 +0000 http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=1088#comment-21657 'I’m beginning to think all writing about writing is bullshit at heart.' - Nope. But writing about what someone's writing means might be. I don't think I've ever read a novel and said "Boy, I sure like that guy's politics." But I've read a lot of writers just for pleasure, for art's sake, and not liked their worldview at all. But I still liked their art. ‘I’m beginning to think all writing about writing is bullshit at heart.’ – Nope. But writing about what someone’s writing means might be.

I don’t think I’ve ever read a novel and said “Boy, I sure like that guy’s politics.” But I’ve read a lot of writers just for pleasure, for art’s sake, and not liked their worldview at all. But I still liked their art.

]]> By: Nick Mamatas http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2009/04/03/the-stupidity-of-writers/comment-page-1/#comment-21656 Nick Mamatas Sat, 04 Apr 2009 03:51:52 +0000 http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=1088#comment-21656 "Art for art's sake" is generally just a not-very-artful recitation of freedom from didactic or moral art. "All art is political" is a truism that has little to do with didactic or moral art, but simply notes that art takes place in a political (or political economic) context, as does war and marriage and breakfast. What did you have for breakfast today? What did the VanderMeers of the 1690s have for breakfast? “Art for art’s sake” is generally just a not-very-artful recitation of freedom from didactic or moral art.

“All art is political” is a truism that has little to do with didactic or moral art, but simply notes that art takes place in a political (or political economic) context, as does war and marriage and breakfast.

What did you have for breakfast today? What did the VanderMeers of the 1690s have for breakfast?

]]> By: Dan Read http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2009/04/03/the-stupidity-of-writers/comment-page-1/#comment-21651 Dan Read Sat, 04 Apr 2009 03:12:56 +0000 http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=1088#comment-21651 Nice one, Jeff. Keep that monkey in line. If I'm certain about anything, it's that certainty is (was?) one of the great indulgences of our current age, one that has done us real harm. Somehow I think the rampant certainty is connected to the other rampant fascination of our current culture, the fetishization of humiliation--but I'm not sure how yet. Maybe enjoying the humiliation of others allows those of us clinging to our certainties to continue clinging a little while longer. Nice one, Jeff. Keep that monkey in line.

If I’m certain about anything, it’s that certainty is (was?) one of the great indulgences of our current age, one that has done us real harm. Somehow I think the rampant certainty is connected to the other rampant fascination of our current culture, the fetishization of humiliation–but I’m not sure how yet. Maybe enjoying the humiliation of others allows those of us clinging to our certainties to continue clinging a little while longer.

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