<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: The Creatures We Don’t See:  Thoughts on the Animal Other</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2008/10/10/the-creatures-we-don%e2%80%99t-see-thoughts-on-the-animal-other/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2008/10/10/the-creatures-we-don%e2%80%99t-see-thoughts-on-the-animal-other/</link>
	<description>Jeff VanderMeer</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 14 Mar 2010 09:42:29 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Vandana Singh</title>
		<link>http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2008/10/10/the-creatures-we-don%e2%80%99t-see-thoughts-on-the-animal-other/comment-page-1/#comment-29340</link>
		<dc:creator>Vandana Singh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jan 2010 20:35:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=2114#comment-29340</guid>
		<description>Dear Suparna, 

Thanks for what you do --- I looked up CUPA and am very impressed.  Here it is, folks: http://www.cupabangalore.org/.  A great response to the random, cruel mindlessness of our species... wishing you best of luck and strength... 

Vandana</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Suparna, </p>
<p>Thanks for what you do &#8212; I looked up CUPA and am very impressed.  Here it is, folks: <a href="http://www.cupabangalore.org/" rel="nofollow">http://www.cupabangalore.org/</a>.  A great response to the random, cruel mindlessness of our species&#8230; wishing you best of luck and strength&#8230; </p>
<p>Vandana</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: suparn baksi ganguly</title>
		<link>http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2008/10/10/the-creatures-we-don%e2%80%99t-see-thoughts-on-the-animal-other/comment-page-1/#comment-29335</link>
		<dc:creator>suparn baksi ganguly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jan 2010 16:46:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=2114#comment-29335</guid>
		<description>Vandana,

I have grown up, like you, in the beautiful, lazy, laidback town of Lucknow of the 1970s and the nature in everyday life that we as children had the priveledge to access. The concept of zoopolis is neither surprising nor dramatic, but a feeling of great loss and regret of how much has got lost in the process of growing up and development in the western mode of cities and societies. Loving animals and nature prompted me to co-found CUPA in Bangalore  , and your article helps me to re-affirm the faith we had then and sometimes threatens to get lost now, with the mindlessness around. I hope we can restore the concept you have written about so well....suparna</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Vandana,</p>
<p>I have grown up, like you, in the beautiful, lazy, laidback town of Lucknow of the 1970s and the nature in everyday life that we as children had the priveledge to access. The concept of zoopolis is neither surprising nor dramatic, but a feeling of great loss and regret of how much has got lost in the process of growing up and development in the western mode of cities and societies. Loving animals and nature prompted me to co-found CUPA in Bangalore  , and your article helps me to re-affirm the faith we had then and sometimes threatens to get lost now, with the mindlessness around. I hope we can restore the concept you have written about so well&#8230;.suparna</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Biophilia, intolerance, future Ramayanas: Vandana Singh Q&#38;A - Ultrabrown</title>
		<link>http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2008/10/10/the-creatures-we-don%e2%80%99t-see-thoughts-on-the-animal-other/comment-page-1/#comment-18952</link>
		<dc:creator>Biophilia, intolerance, future Ramayanas: Vandana Singh Q&#38;A - Ultrabrown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2009 23:42:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=2114#comment-18952</guid>
		<description>[...] wrote an essay recently about the self-absorption of our species and our refusal to “see” other life-forms. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] wrote an essay recently about the self-absorption of our species and our refusal to “see” other life-forms. [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Anna Tambour</title>
		<link>http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2008/10/10/the-creatures-we-don%e2%80%99t-see-thoughts-on-the-animal-other/comment-page-1/#comment-16598</link>
		<dc:creator>Anna Tambour</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Oct 2008 06:09:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=2114#comment-16598</guid>
		<description>Vandana and Roopa,
You might also like another story by Bharatram Gaba, who has a fine rage, and an indelicate compassion.
http://www.annatambour.net/Mama-BharatramGaba.htm
and you can see more by him at his site,
http://bratgaba.sulekha.com/
including essays such as Gropeway of India
http://bratgaba.sulekha.com/blog/post/2007/01/gropeway-of-india.htm

Your pigeon story is delightful, Vandana. And your point of other creatures being &quot;so peripheral to our existence that we don&#039;t really see them&quot; is important. It strikes me often that people have pets and don&#039;t even think of them as anything more than animated decorations. The last edition of New Scientist had an essay that is many years overdue: Flaws on Paws: Welfare Problems in Breeding Pedigree Dogs. 
http://www.usyd.edu.au/news/84.html?newsstoryid=2695
We live in the middle of bush here, and occasionally, a raptor-injured racing pigeon stops by and recuperates on our balcony--it looks to humans as protectors.
In New York, the hawk-nest controversy gained international attention.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4082491.stm

But what I really should say is that this post by you and the comments it has sparked are what I think that the web should be. Thank you for writing it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Vandana and Roopa,<br />
You might also like another story by Bharatram Gaba, who has a fine rage, and an indelicate compassion.<br />
<a href="http://www.annatambour.net/Mama-BharatramGaba.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.annatambour.net/Mama-BharatramGaba.htm</a><br />
and you can see more by him at his site,<br />
<a href="http://bratgaba.sulekha.com/" rel="nofollow">http://bratgaba.sulekha.com/</a><br />
including essays such as Gropeway of India<br />
<a href="http://bratgaba.sulekha.com/blog/post/2007/01/gropeway-of-india.htm" rel="nofollow">http://bratgaba.sulekha.com/blog/post/2007/01/gropeway-of-india.htm</a></p>
<p>Your pigeon story is delightful, Vandana. And your point of other creatures being &#8220;so peripheral to our existence that we don&#8217;t really see them&#8221; is important. It strikes me often that people have pets and don&#8217;t even think of them as anything more than animated decorations. The last edition of New Scientist had an essay that is many years overdue: Flaws on Paws: Welfare Problems in Breeding Pedigree Dogs.<br />
<a href="http://www.usyd.edu.au/news/84.html?newsstoryid=2695" rel="nofollow">http://www.usyd.edu.au/news/84.html?newsstoryid=2695</a><br />
We live in the middle of bush here, and occasionally, a raptor-injured racing pigeon stops by and recuperates on our balcony&#8211;it looks to humans as protectors.<br />
In New York, the hawk-nest controversy gained international attention.<br />
<a href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4082491.stm" rel="nofollow">http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4082491.stm</a></p>
<p>But what I really should say is that this post by you and the comments it has sparked are what I think that the web should be. Thank you for writing it.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Vandana Singh</title>
		<link>http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2008/10/10/the-creatures-we-don%e2%80%99t-see-thoughts-on-the-animal-other/comment-page-1/#comment-16554</link>
		<dc:creator>Vandana Singh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Oct 2008 14:14:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=2114#comment-16554</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m surfacing after a very busy period at work and apologize for the late response.  Neha, I hear you about lack of imagination, imagination being a faculty of which I&#039;m rather fond.  I do want to clarify that the roadkill example (which I suggested in a somewhat tentative way) was motivated not by identifying yourself with a plant or animal but simply by being aware of its existence as a fellow being.  I think other creatures are so peripheral to our existence that we don&#039;t really see them.  That was what I was attempting to point out.  

Celsius1414, narrow escape!  Glad you are here to tell the tale.  

Anna, I finally got a chance to read the story Excreta Etc.  Thanks so much for the link.  the story was stunning.  Brought back memories, too, of the pigeons who nested on the window ledges of my various homes in India.  Some of them chose the weirdest places.  A couple of years ago my aunt&#039;s fourth floor balcony was the site of one such unusual place.  There was a square-shaped depression in the balcony&#039;s cement floor, presumably for drainage of rainwater, and the bird chose to build a nest there.  My aunt made sure nobody disturbed her and I even managed to take a photo from the window, of the motehr bird sitting serenely on her eggs.  the balcony was a little too high for cats so it turned out to be a good spot for a nest after all.  

Vandana</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m surfacing after a very busy period at work and apologize for the late response.  Neha, I hear you about lack of imagination, imagination being a faculty of which I&#8217;m rather fond.  I do want to clarify that the roadkill example (which I suggested in a somewhat tentative way) was motivated not by identifying yourself with a plant or animal but simply by being aware of its existence as a fellow being.  I think other creatures are so peripheral to our existence that we don&#8217;t really see them.  That was what I was attempting to point out.  </p>
<p>Celsius1414, narrow escape!  Glad you are here to tell the tale.  </p>
<p>Anna, I finally got a chance to read the story Excreta Etc.  Thanks so much for the link.  the story was stunning.  Brought back memories, too, of the pigeons who nested on the window ledges of my various homes in India.  Some of them chose the weirdest places.  A couple of years ago my aunt&#8217;s fourth floor balcony was the site of one such unusual place.  There was a square-shaped depression in the balcony&#8217;s cement floor, presumably for drainage of rainwater, and the bird chose to build a nest there.  My aunt made sure nobody disturbed her and I even managed to take a photo from the window, of the motehr bird sitting serenely on her eggs.  the balcony was a little too high for cats so it turned out to be a good spot for a nest after all.  </p>
<p>Vandana</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ranjit Lal on birds, beasts and Delhi - Ultrabrown</title>
		<link>http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2008/10/10/the-creatures-we-don%e2%80%99t-see-thoughts-on-the-animal-other/comment-page-1/#comment-16421</link>
		<dc:creator>Ranjit Lal on birds, beasts and Delhi - Ultrabrown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 19:27:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=2114#comment-16421</guid>
		<description>[...] Lal on birds, beasts and Delhi  Coincidentally, just the day after I linked to this Vandana Singh post about human self-absorption and how we blind ourselves to the fascinating micro-worlds of other [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Lal on birds, beasts and Delhi  Coincidentally, just the day after I linked to this Vandana Singh post about human self-absorption and how we blind ourselves to the fascinating micro-worlds of other [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Celsius1414</title>
		<link>http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2008/10/10/the-creatures-we-don%e2%80%99t-see-thoughts-on-the-animal-other/comment-page-1/#comment-16337</link>
		<dc:creator>Celsius1414</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 19:08:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=2114#comment-16337</guid>
		<description>After a sobering experience involving a truck and my bicycle a few years back, I began to wonder just how many of those dead animals on the road are accidents:

http://www.celsius1414.com/vitality_and_morbidity</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>After a sobering experience involving a truck and my bicycle a few years back, I began to wonder just how many of those dead animals on the road are accidents:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.celsius1414.com/vitality_and_morbidity" rel="nofollow">http://www.celsius1414.com/vitality_and_morbidity</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Neha</title>
		<link>http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2008/10/10/the-creatures-we-don%e2%80%99t-see-thoughts-on-the-animal-other/comment-page-1/#comment-16313</link>
		<dc:creator>Neha</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 08:10:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=2114#comment-16313</guid>
		<description>I think the major cause for such a lack of animals in literature is simply - lack of imagination. Unless one is genuinely imaginative, it would be difficult to write as anyone else but human and for anyone else but human. (I cannot write in a male voice, no matter how much I try - I cannot get into their head. If I try really hard I can personify plants - animals are too complicated.) 

Dune trilogy had a lot of animals in them, I guess it depends on the story as well. 

Road-kill, I believe, is a different problem, the causes might overlap but I think are essentially different. (For instance tho I neither identify with the male of my species nor with the plants or animals, I have always been very aware of the people and the birds on the road and have never killed any.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the major cause for such a lack of animals in literature is simply &#8211; lack of imagination. Unless one is genuinely imaginative, it would be difficult to write as anyone else but human and for anyone else but human. (I cannot write in a male voice, no matter how much I try &#8211; I cannot get into their head. If I try really hard I can personify plants &#8211; animals are too complicated.) </p>
<p>Dune trilogy had a lot of animals in them, I guess it depends on the story as well. </p>
<p>Road-kill, I believe, is a different problem, the causes might overlap but I think are essentially different. (For instance tho I neither identify with the male of my species nor with the plants or animals, I have always been very aware of the people and the birds on the road and have never killed any.)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Anil Menon</title>
		<link>http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2008/10/10/the-creatures-we-don%e2%80%99t-see-thoughts-on-the-animal-other/comment-page-1/#comment-16231</link>
		<dc:creator>Anil Menon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Oct 2008 10:23:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=2114#comment-16231</guid>
		<description>Jeff: Agreed on the disconnect from the natural world. Were the education system already not being thrashed so regularly, I would&#039;ve been tempted to give it another thrashing for this state of affairs. btw, I like the word &quot;dissociation.&quot; Just like Zoopolis, it feels like one of those words around which people, ideas and movements can gather. 

Vandana: I echo the need for different mindsets. I&#039;m quite optimistic about the planet&#039;s prospects actually. Life has been around for a long, long time, and perhaps we beat ourselves up too much over the last 4000 or 5000 years. Here we are, idiot-geniuses, six years old, thrown into a dark and shadowed room, with just enough grub for a few weeks and told that all of life depends on our unraveling this
humongous ball of chewing gum and twine. What&#039;s amazing, really, is that the kid is even bothering to try.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeff: Agreed on the disconnect from the natural world. Were the education system already not being thrashed so regularly, I would&#8217;ve been tempted to give it another thrashing for this state of affairs. btw, I like the word &#8220;dissociation.&#8221; Just like Zoopolis, it feels like one of those words around which people, ideas and movements can gather. </p>
<p>Vandana: I echo the need for different mindsets. I&#8217;m quite optimistic about the planet&#8217;s prospects actually. Life has been around for a long, long time, and perhaps we beat ourselves up too much over the last 4000 or 5000 years. Here we are, idiot-geniuses, six years old, thrown into a dark and shadowed room, with just enough grub for a few weeks and told that all of life depends on our unraveling this<br />
humongous ball of chewing gum and twine. What&#8217;s amazing, really, is that the kid is even bothering to try.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: roopa</title>
		<link>http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/2008/10/10/the-creatures-we-don%e2%80%99t-see-thoughts-on-the-animal-other/comment-page-1/#comment-16230</link>
		<dc:creator>roopa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Oct 2008 10:20:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jeffvandermeer.com/?p=2114#comment-16230</guid>
		<description>Anna, I just read Excreta etc. on your website. It is lovely. Can I forward it to a yahoo wildlife group that I am a member of. It reminds me of a two penny guard of a residential area of Delhi who hit  a little monkey so hard with a stone that bright red blood drops from its tiny hands  fell on the ground but it hung from the sewer pipe on the third floor nevertheless, having nowhere else to go.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anna, I just read Excreta etc. on your website. It is lovely. Can I forward it to a yahoo wildlife group that I am a member of. It reminds me of a two penny guard of a residential area of Delhi who hit  a little monkey so hard with a stone that bright red blood drops from its tiny hands  fell on the ground but it hung from the sewer pipe on the third floor nevertheless, having nowhere else to go.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
